xkcd #3232: Countdown Standard
Title text:
Anyone who is caught counting ‘three … two … one … zero … GO!’ will be punished with a lifetime of eating only ISO standard food samples.
Transcript:
Transcript will show once it’s been added to explainxkcd.com
Source: https://xkcd.com/3232/
Is this not universal? It seems so obvious.
Except according to ISO 8601, Monday is the first day of the week, and it is the definition used in some english-speaking countries (Ireland, occasionally the UK). That means every Sunday there is a definite ambiguity as to which day is “this Thursday”.
(Funnily enough, if we’re invoking ISO 8601, it also defines that weeks are anchored to a year by whatever year their Thursday is in.)
I used to go by Monday–Sunday, but I’ve grown into a firm believer of Sunday–Saturday. I’m going to start my own standards organization, and we’ll have incredible tea, open access, and civilized boundaries for weeks. [relevant xkcd here]
Fair point that there’s some ambiguity, albeit not caused by an inherent ambiguity between “this” and “next”. I’d just invoke “next Thursday” in that situation because it’s the same regardless of apostasy.
I’m curious as to why. Obviously it doesn’t really matter. I can’t think of any arguments for Sunday–Saturday, and the only argument I have for Monday–Sunday is that in that case the “weekend” is actually the end of the week, rather than awkwardly split up. But then the word for “weekend” is different in different languages, so it’s a very English-specific argument.
That flaw in the “weekend” argument you point out is actually where I realized Monday–Sunday that I grew up with wasn’t as obvious as I thought. I like Sunday–Saturday mainly for the structural symmetry. (This is also somewhat cultural, but I think most places nowadays would standardize around Sunday/Saturday being stereotypical “off” days.) Every week starts with one stereotypical “off” day and ends with one stereotypical “off” day with five “business” days sandwiched between (thus “Hump Day” too is the exact middle of the week rather than just the business week). It’s not that big of a deal, but I think it’s cleaner. Unlike 24-hour time versus 12-hour, I don’t have a solid empirical argument. I’m wrong by ISO standards, but then then MDY and DMY are colloquially used much more common in most places than YMD, so I’m rarely abiding by ISO standards there.
That’s awesome, thanks for sharing. I did not know that.
For many, “next Thursday” is the next available Thursday, three days hence (if you’re reading this on a Monday)
This doesn’t make sense from a linguistics standpoint though. So next Thursday is the Thursday this week, but next week isn’t this week, it’s the week after this one. So what’s the Thursday in that week, the next next Thursday? It just doesn’t work.
Anything in this week (Sunday-Saturday or Monday-Sunday) even stuff from a few days ago -> this <day of the week>.
Anything from last week -> last <dotw>
Anything in next week -> next <dotw>
It’s incredibly simple and it’s logically consistent and it works in every situation unless you are talking to someone from a different country that uses a different starting day. And even then it works the majority of the time.
You’re trying to apply logic to English? You’re also assuming people actually think about what they’re saying or even know the so called rules of English. If that were the case we wouldn’t have people mixing up their/there/they’re or your/you’re its/it’s etc.
Fact of the matter, if everything you said were true, we wouldn’t have people wishing for a way to clarify and we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
What the fuck. 😭 But “next Thursday” clearly has a well-defined 7-day period. Given a bus stop with 20 minutes between buses, the “next bus” doesn’t just start arbitrarily applying 10 minutes after the last bus left. Who would use it like this??
“This Thursday” is the closest Thursday coming up, “next Thursday” is the next one after that
Internal consistency test:
It’s May 2024. You’re talking about February 2025. Given the choice only between “This February” and “Next February”, which do you call it?
I think scale matters. A year is quite a lot longer than a week or two. It’s easy to consider both the next Thursday you’re going to encounter and the one after that as subjectively “soon”. The same can not be said of a month at least nine months away.
I would agree that your ruleset works on a longer timescale, but not on a shorter one. There’s too much ambiguity and crossover for it to work properly. Having exclusivity in definition allows for better communication, especially for something much more personal like something sooner rather than later.
You’re right, after some further thought I forgot one rule that I use. Will edit to fix this
To answer your question, I wouldn’t use either, it would be “last February”
I think you misread my comment. February 2025 from the perspective of May 2024 is not “last Thursday” by any definition.
Sorry, it being 2026 now was making be constantly think of 2025 in the past instead of the “future”
I’m with you so far as “next” should always the next occurrence of the day, and maybe in some places it does. But practically it doesn’t work. In every place I’ve lived it works like this: “this week” isn’t a set Monday – Sunday like you suggest, but a rolling seven days. Its Monday as I write this, “this Wednesday” is two days from now, while “next Wednesday” is the following. Same for this vs next weekend. If it’s Friday, “this Monday” is three days away. Rolling seven days.
“This” cannot be used for the day of week you are currently on, nor can it be used for previous days.
I feel strongly that “next” Thursday should be not the next instance of a Thursday but rather the first instance of a Thursday past the contained set of the current week (so the next row on a calendar). I.e. if it’s Tuesday, “next Thursday” isn’t the Thursday two days from now but the Thursday 9 days from now.
Wrong. Weeks start on Monday. Sunday is the last day of the week. A week is 5 work days and 2 days of the weekend. I will have none of this Sunday bs.
So if it’s a Friday, “This Thursday” was yesterday? How does that make sense?
“This Thursday” is always the upcoming Thursday.
Last Thursday was fucking yesterday.
Okay but what about last Thursday?