“NoFap”
How does anyone take this group seriously knowing they are a 4chan grift? With a name like that this is an obvious psyop to keep “normies” busy defending against them.
Send these fucking ogres back to middle earth
Actually, it started on 4chan as a joke and migrated to Reddit where it was taken seriously by religious weirdos who will tell you anything to get their foot in the door.
They’d label themselves as recovering porn addicts, but permit conversations about semen retention giving them the mental clarity of a Buddhist monk.
If you cross reference the mods of that sub you’ll find they moderate Christian sub’s too (although, it was a few years ago when I checked but it’s probably still true).
At this point I’m pretty sure nothing on 4chan starts as a joke
I mean… Not nowadays, sure… But 20 years ago 4chan was where memes were born.
But your implication is that it was a serious claim on 4chan? Nah, it was another troll device to mess with people.
In some sense, it was the most pure form of joke.
Porn addiction and compulsive masturbation are real things - something I’ve dealt with most of my life. I never really turned to NoFap because it always felt too ideological for my taste, but that doesn’t change the fact that there are a ton of real people there struggling and desperately trying to get help.
I have no issue criticizing any kind of extremism, but I just felt the need to remind everyone not to throw the baby out with the bathwater or dismiss it as not a real issue. It’s not that porn or masturbation is inherently bad. Some people just take it way too far to the point that it starts actively harming them - same as with any potentially addictive behavior.
compulsive masturbation are real things - something I’ve dealt with most of my life.
Porn addiction is one thing I guess… But I feel like people need to stop beating themselves up (heh) about masturbating often. It’s a bodily function and it’s healthy.
People aren’t “addicted” to blowing their nose, sneezing, farting, scratching their armpits, etc
“Masturbating often” isn’t the issue here. It’s 4+ hour long sessions 5+ times a week.
Hey, thank you so much for mentioning this!
Some people just take it way too far to the point that it starts actively harming them Yes, I agree.
Addiction to porn is harmful (just like any addiction), it causes the addict to be more lonely, and think of women as sex objects.
Masturbation addiction is a huge time waster(again just like any addiction).
remind everyone not to throw the baby out with the bathwater or dismiss it as not a real issue.
Is it thought? Rarely compulsive behavior manifests in this way in the same way someone must wash their hands or clean something until it’s destroyed.
Religious fruitcakes have decided to call this out and make it a war cry while making a lot of men think they’re mental when in fact they’re horny and society via religious rules forbid talking about it openly and learning to understand your body and relationships.
Same deal with circumcision.
It’s not that porn or masturbation is bad. Spending 4+ hours a day, 5+ days a week on it is. If you don’t believe this to be the case, then I’d genuinely like to hear your reasoning.
well, what about going to work ? that’s even longer and even more of a waste of time. it’s your time do with it as you wish.
People don’t generally try and seek help for behaviour they wish to continue.
We put legal caps on who can gamble and where not because it can be addictive but because it can have damaging affects on anyone who uses money because it is a game of chance, at which you can lose, and it requires an adults ability to make decisions about property (where the law doesn’t recognize the property of minors).
Fundamentally what you are arguing is that there are people who have an addiction and you want advocacy for those people, at the cost of the freedoms of other people, because that’s exactly what this co-opted group is trying to achieve. That’s why you receive pushback against your comments.
Addiction is a psychological medical issue. If you have an addiction it’s very likely that you need medical help to deal with that addiction and treat/overcome it. That doesn’t mean that lawfully people who don’t have that addiction should be forced to put themselves in danger to have whatever materials you happen to be addicted to.
and you want advocacy for those people
No, I don’t. I’m only asking people not to dismiss addiction to porn or masturbation as not being a real thing or harmful.
I just told someone that spending 4+ hours a day, 5+ days a week on it is actively harming me, and the response was that going to work is an even bigger waste of time and that I’m free to spend my free time however I want. That’s an unbelievably idiotic thing to say to someone who’s trying to kick an addiction.
There are people in the world who think addiction doesn’t exist full stop. That’s part of the reason I used gambling addiction as an example.
You aren’t going to convince people who don’t believe. It’s not worth it to try to remind them because they aren’t going to change their mind unless they experience it in their real lives.
But the problem here is that the aim of this group isn’t to bring awareness of porn addiction, and advocate for the people afflicted with it. The main aim of this group is to further their religion based vendetta against the porn industry. That’s actively harmful to people like you who have an addiction. Specifically because it makes other people take you less seriously.
And yet here you are trying to (at best) hitch your sail about pron addiction to an article and discussion about a group that are actively harming you, who also did a bunch of illegal shit to people who studied the group and released information about it that wasn’t flattering to them
Those illegal actions include doxxing and inciting people to sexual assault one of those researchers.
Maybe read the room.
Yeah but 4 hours a day of a lot of things would be equally insane…
Yes, and when you can’t stop on your own it’s generally advisable to try and find help.
Among these were Prause’s [scientist] past encounters with Rhodes [NoFap guy], which included the 2019 lawsuit, and Prause accusing Rhodes of attempted murder.
What?
I looked at the lawsuit. Keep in mind that this is the evidence presented by the NoFap guy, which never mentions whether he posted Nicole Prause’s address anywhere, but the information looks pretty damning.
Since the Prior Litigation concluded, Defendant Prause has continued to make the defamatory and absurd claim that Plaintiff Rhodes attempted to murder her. For example, on December 28, 2021, Defendant Prause posted on her @NicoleRPrause Twitter account that
“after Wilson posted my physical address I was sexually assaulted outside of my laboratory. We later found out one of his followers had flown to Los Angeles that weekend with a gun intending to [‘]confront[’] me.”
On April 03, 2022, Defendant Prause posted to her @NicoleRPrause Twitter account:
“When I heard an anti-porn activist flew across the country with a gun & body camera in his luggage to [‘]confront[‘] me and film it, our gun laws did not stop him.”
In another section, a journalist is quoted. I think he messaged NoFap guy asking about this prior doxxing.
“Prause’s biggest concern is the posting of addresses where she may physically be, regardless of your dispute over whether it’s a “residential” address or not. What was the purpose of you posting her possible location? Do you plan on doing it again in the future?” and “What conditions would it take for you to cease your public documentation of Prause’s activities and claims that she is an alleged ‘industry shill’ who commits ‘false science’?"
The lawsuit continues, without pushing back on these questions.
Really interesting because I could easily see this go both ways.
Scientists from a psychology releated field doing dodgy stuff is pretty much expected. “Researching comments” from a subreddit is weird, especially if it’s done without asking for consent first. That was a thing that bit someone else the other time. Also, a specific researcher being stuck on this support group in particular? For 6 six years or more? Why? If it’s not specifically targeting that group, why is that worthy of study in particular? Aren’t there other self help groups online that could be researched?
But also, it’s not just a subreddit, it’s an LLC and if there is money involved the pendulum of truth could easily swing the other way instead.
tldr: Da fuq they doin’ ova there?!
I could really see this going both ways. I wish they had pictures of the members. Just the thought of how pent up they must be every second. of every minute. of every hour. of every aaaoooooohhhhhhhaaa
Over a year before filing its lawsuit, NoFap asked Taylor & Francis to pay $20 million to avoid being named as codefendant, according to emails Retraction Watch has seen.
Well that certainly helps their credibility.
If they busted a nut once in awhile maybe they wouldn’t be so whiny, high strung and litigious.
I stumbled upon a massive blog with several pages devoted to attacking one of the scientists who’s the target of this lawsuit. It spends thousands of words, paired with obsessive screenshots and photos of Cease and Desist orders, claiming the woman is actually the bad one, and repeatedly insisting she’s an industry plant. Wild claims link to more wild claims.
“High-strung” is putting it nicely.
Isn’t this the reason we are supposed to eat Graham crackers?
And Kellogg’s cereal
Self hating losers
Aren’t they more of a cult than a legit addiction treatment organization?
synanon knowers
Like any group, it consists of individuals - and the differences among members within the group are usually greater than the differences between that group and others. Also, cults tend to form around a charismatic leader, whereas this is just a self-selected bunch of people.
So how about the Rationalists? They are a cultlike group with a charismatic founder (Eli Yudkowsky), despite the founder’s well-documented proximity to rampant sexual abuse, and even a group of his followers committing acts of violence in line with his ideology.
Would you consider at least this group to be a cult, and worthy of condemnation?
The entire concept is build on reactionary ideology and has absolutely nothing constructive or positive about it. Everyone involved are a bunch of fascist assholes.
This is not new, presbyterian minister and dietary reformer Sylvester Graham invented special crackers to prevent masturbation in 1829. John Kellog invented corn flakes to stop masturbation in 1898.
No nut cults have been a US thing for 200 years.
Those damn fascists again.
The goal isn’t to treat addiction.
It’s to repress urges to make their followers frustrated, angry, and willing to overthrow modern society…
It’s not a new tactic. But it’s hard to convince young men to stop jacking off.
When you are a young man its jack off or wet dream. Pick one.
But it’s hard to convince young men to stop jacking off.
Sylvester Graham tried with his crackers.
John Kellog tried with his corn flakes.
US is fucking weird about sex.
Wait, Graham crackers too?
Puritans founded the country. Mormons, Evangelicals and many others came from the Puritans.
Imo, a lot of problems stem from puritanical beliefs in the US. The gender divide, alpha male, etc.
Controlling sexuality keeps religion going strong
The US has always been about a bunch of religious cults.
What is this about graham crackers and cornflakes?
Both were purposely bland foods designed only for the purpose of discouraging masturbation, which Graham and Kellogg were convinced drained life energy.
Again, US has always been weird about sex.
I knew about corn flakes, but not about graham crackers. Basically, the inventor of corn flakes whole reason for inventing them was to give young men something to eat in the morning that was so incredibly boring they would lose the will to ever get hard again. Or something like that.
I assumed they’d turn up in the Epstein files. He funded tons of adjacent shit.
Let me run in by scientologist
