If you’re already with Linux, this is not for you. This is for people who’re indecisive or been contemplating for long about whether to make that jump.
For me, it’s a matter of a few things. I’m on a Windows 10 version that guarantees me until 2032 of support. That means I would effectively skip Windows 11, like I already mostly have and potentially skip Windows 12 if that turns out to be a shitty choice. I’d be coming in right in time for whatever Microslop shits out for Win13.
Should Windows 13 suck, I think that’s a consideration. Another consideration is when Valve keeps dropping support for certain Windows versions of Steam. Because I know for a fact they will drop Windows 10 support entirely one day and then Windows 11. I believe it is really stupid that they do this.
By the time my Windows 10 version expires, I’d be getting older, which means I’ll probably care less and less about computer-related things. Going to Linux wouldn’t be a problem since I’d be doing barebones things like browsing and checking e-mail.
And I’d also hope that by 2032, Linux would have better development like easier access to proprietary drivers and software among other things.
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A lack of laziness I suppose. I’ve been using it on and off over the years and have Mint in dual boot right now in preperation for a post-win10 migration, but I’m constantly running into various small/large issues. In the past few years I’ve had issues with wifi drivers, with gpu drivers (f u again nvidia), issues with sleep mode and battery drain, issues with finding equivalent os management tools ( totalcmd, task manager, treeview etc ), issues with “alternative source” games etc. I’ve also had issues wrapping my head around bottles and wine prefixes ( but I will admit wine is an excellent piece of software and has come a looong way since the mid 00s ).
Linux is great if you’re a tinkerer because you will need to tinker with it at some point or another. But as I get older I just can’t be arsed most of the time.
This is pretty much me. If Linux and associated software like Proton were at their current state 10 years ago, I would’ve made the jump by now. At this point, I just can’t be bothered. I work in IT, so I already deal with computer stuff at work, and I really don’t want to tinker with my pc at home as well. I bought some extra storage a few months ago, partially in preparation to try Linux, but have yet to install it.
A time machine: I already switched 6 or 7 years ago, after 40+ years using Apple ;)
Do I miss stuff? Yep. Is it ok to miss them? For me, yep too.
It needs to actually work.
No display issues with Nvidia. Working HDR out of the box. The OS and games most pick up the correct resolution both on desktop and running in proton. I need to be able to turn my monitor off and on without having to remove and insert the HDMI.
Same with audio. I need it to correctly detect my HDMI pass through and not need a script to run on boot to pull and grep a changing device id on every fucking update.
Finally I need Bluetooth to not be a total piece of shit and correctly support a controller without latency.
Now, where is the nerd to come screech at me, tell me my issues were fixed a decade ago and that Linux just works perfectly on random hardware and that Linux is so easy an idiot could do it? All the while I spend 40 hours a week on the cli and ide.
Even steam deck has a bunch of issues that needs will hand wave away.
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Sounds like most of your problem is NVIDIA. I don’t have any of that on AMD. But if that’s what you have that’s what you have. I’m not blaming you. Unfortunately NVIDIA (the company) is just not as good about making their stuff work with Linux.
Bluetooth works great for me. At least since I switched from a shitty old Broadcom wireless card to a modern Intel wireless one.
Checks clock. 40m.
So you’re just going to have wave away the other 2/3rd? I get it Nvidia made it a pain in the ass. What excuse for BT, HDMI, and Wi-Fi?
Normal people aren’t going to buy hardware just to use Linux.
Like I said I’m not blaming you. If that’s the reality for you I’m not here to prosthelytize. Maybe you can try again on your next PC if you’re still trying to get away from Windows.
BT
Commented on
HDMI
NVIDIA, along with HDMI audio.
WiFi
Not something you mentioned but honestly not something I’ve had a problem with in 5+ years across a lot of hardware. Except this one old Broadcom card that was pulled from a Mac because I wanted to try Hackintoshing (running macOS on a normal PC).
Your HDMI problems are Nvidia’s fault. WIFI I’ve never had problems unless it’s a shitty WIFI card, BT also works, even with my shitty adapter. No noticable latency on a DualSense controller.
Perfection. No notes.
For most people? Their friends will have to do it.
Unfortunately, I am forced to use the much hated Adobe Creative Suite. Also, it would take some serious time and effort to break free from the Apple ecosystem. I did start moving certain services away, i.e. email and backup, so that an eventual move in the future is a bit less painful. It‘s a process.
Microslop’s Windows
11Failed projects in a trenchcoat.All my personal PCs and vms are Linux but for work I occasionally need to use a laptop that is on a mangled win 10 ltsc release that’s been gutted of most any dial home shit and returns update choices to the user.
The minute my tools all work on Linux properly that’s getting converted too.
My desktop PC is already running on Linux. I’ve been holding onto my Macbook because I was under the impression that neither Photoshop or DaVinvi Resolve work on Linux but I believe this to no longer be the case so I’ll either switch to Framework at some point or I just go back to using only desktop PC as I don’t exactly take advantage of my laptop’s portability anyway.
Davinci works, tho it tends to be buggy and requires some tinkering to get it working. Really hit and miss. When it comes to photoshop your best bet is running it through wine
Resolve is officially supported on Linux and it’s worked for me fine. The way you’re putting it makes it sound like it only barely works with some hacking or something and that is just not true.
I’m a whole lot less computer literate than I was when I attempted it in my 20s, I also really only play some games nowadays and binge watch stupid on YouTube… the computer has become less of my life in my 40s so learning a new system sounds like… work.
I empathize with this even as a highly computer literate person who works in tech. I turn 40 this year, and when I’m off the clock, I need to read books, touch grass, and live my life as if I don’t know how computers work.
For me it’s not about whether it is more work or not. It is more along the lines of, tolerating microsoft’s bullshit for any longer. Windows 10 in more ways than one, has teetered me towards the edge of switching. Because I hate stupid mandatory updates, I hate how insultingly stupid it is to use a Windows system these days and every dumb decision Microsoft has made that has turned Windows into what it is and what it will be in the future.
I won’t mind a little work to use my machine, long as it frees me from all of that bullshit.
If the current situation hasn’t gotten you to switch then you’re not gonna switch in 2032. You’ll probably just have some other excuses.
I think this is a very valid reason. I used to reinstall Windows every 6 months or so for various reasons, switching to Linux wasn’t any more work. But if you don’t enjoy researching, installing OSs, etc then it’s only ever going to feel like a chore.
Look, to be perfectly honest, I’ve had to do far less “computery” bullshit on Linux. After about six months of everything just working fast and flawless, I realised Windows is the OS that requires a pretty high level of computer literacy. Even installing Linux is a simple and quick breeze compared to Windows.
All it took was a final, “Oh, for fuck’s sake! That’s it! I’m fucking done!” moment. I just didn’t want to do it anymore. Never had one since. Using a computer is a nice thing again.
I 100% recommend Linux for grandparents!
It’s fast and easy and no big deal until you want to do something radical like create a shortcut and pin it to your taskbar, or share a folder on a home network. Or share your screen with a TV… there have been too many damn times where I’ve wanted to do something that should be simple and the matter of a couple clicks but it sends me down a rabbit hole chasing dependencies and searching terminal commands and spending hours doing something that takes less than a minute on mainstream operating systems. My user experience has drastically improved since I swapped to Plasma but don’t pretend everything works perfectly and intuitively immediately for everyone unless the expected use case is literally turning it on and opening a browser.
OK, almost none of that is a problem anymore (at least with KDE Plasma), but also, do you remember using Windows? Don’t act as if Windows doesn’t have similar issues. When you do weird things sometimes that weird thing doesn’t work how you expect and you have to search for an answer. The answer tends to be far easier, to find and implement, than on Windows though, in my experience.
No OS is perfect. Stop pretending like Windows is.
All of the things I listed are examples from my personal experience that I ran into within the past 6 months. The sharing folder adventure happened just about two weeks ago. Don’t try to tell me that it’s all so easy now, I literally just went through hours of research and experimenting and samba settings and changing my disk’s fstab file just to get a folder to show up on my home network. “Oh well you should have done x or y or not used z” Well, frankly it doesn’t matter what the optimal workflow solution would be, what matters is this was my user experience. This was something I went through and was not some whacky fringe use case. Sharing a folder on a home network is not black magic or calling upon arcane demonic powers.
Now, I’m not going back at this point and I’m committed to Linux now, but pretending it’s all smooth sailing and so easy and polished is misleading. It’s certainly more usable than it ever has been but I think most people on Lemmy have no idea how hands off the average person is from their tech. It’s important to be honest about Linux’s shortcomings and prepare new users that they will probably gave to look up info or documentation for some tasks. You also can’t expect the average person to ever open Terminal without hyperventilating.
Don’t try to tell me that it’s all so easy now, I literally just went through hours of research and experimenting and samba settings and changing my disk’s fstab file just to get a folder to show up on my home network.
For most people, it is (and has been) that easy. If it works as intended, you can simply open your desktop explorer thing, click on network and have it show up. I know that because that has been my experience a couple of years ago and I was surprised at it just working so flawlessly. To be clear, I’m not denying your issues, I’m just pointing out that your experience is not automatically the average experience.
Of course there can be bugs and other issues which require troubleshooting, but that’s not specifically a linux issue.
The difference is that for non-techies, it’s harder to troubleshoot because advice you find is mostly written for techies, there is less info and there are a lot of different linux based operating systems.
For techies, it’s generally easier to troubleshoot because you can get more info out of the system (if you know how) and you generally have more power over the system.
but pretending it’s all smooth sailing and so easy and polished is misleading.
I agree, you cannot generalize a personal experience and then universally apply it to every person as well as every linux based distribution, like “it’ll work flawlessly out of the box because that’s been my experience”. You also cannot generalize it over every linux based system. I have tried a lot of different distros with different hardware and my experience has varied a lot. I have had issues and bugs with ubuntu that just didn’t happen with arch based distros.
But again, it’s virtually never smooth sailing for everyone in every case. Windows users have to troubleshoot issues and bugs too.
It’s important to be honest about Linux’s shortcomings and prepare new users that they will probably gave to look up info or documentation for some tasks.
My problem is people pointing out issues where you have to do this on Linux and pretending like Windows doesn’t have the same issues. People pretend like Windows is flawless, but it’s only because they forgot how much shit they has to deal with learning it. Yes, you’ll have to learn new things. You had to with Windows too. The Linux experience is easier.
You also can’t expect the average person to ever open Terminal without hyperventilating.
The average person isn’t doing more than opening a web browser. They’ll be fine without ever touching the console, just as they were on Windows. The type of user who wants to do more probably also has edited registries in Windows, which is so much worse than anything you’ll do on Linux. Every person switching will have an easier time on Linux than they did on Windows. They might not remember the shit they did to get Windows working how they want, or the garbage they deal with constantly, but that’s just because they got accustomed to it. If you spend the time with Linux to get used to it then it’s easier. It does take time though, and no one is saying it doesn’t. So did (and does, as they constantly change things) Windows.
Wat? I’m on bazzite tbf, a locked garden where you’re not allowed to do anything Advanced tbf, but I literally just right click create shortcut. Or if I want to pin it… I right click “add to task manager”
Not sure if you’ve tried installing things outside of Lutris or Steam, but just for reference here are the instructions for creating a launcher for a program that’s not part of a software manager:
I think this experience is possible, but it’s a bit lucky; requiring every piece of hardware to match, and no software needs to represent hurdles.
I’ve fought a few of those hurdles and they haven’t been so bad. I think your experience is great when it happens, but it’s hardly a guarantee.
Bazzite seems like it would fit perfectly with you then
My wife wants to switch eventually but might not be before windows 12
She does 99% of her computer stuff in a browser anyway, and the last 1% is in the ms office suite, which is why she hasnt moved yet
She would like to switch to libreoffice but she is not interested in learning that yet
You can also run all the office stuff in WinBoat. Only Office is pretty close to ms office as well, but is missing some really important stuff that really pissed my wife off.
Could use the browser versions of the office tools as an intermediary.
Or just select Windows when booting up. I do that simply for 365 when remote working. Clean Windows install on its own drive and somehow it still gives me grief 🤣
Today Outlook and Power BI didn’t open. Spent about twenty minutes updating, reinstalling, rebooting, and nothing. Had a meeting, reboot, all works again. Silly me never completed the random ritual in order.
For various reasons, my family is tied to a small number of programs that don’t have 1:1 equivalents on Linux. So far nobody is willing to deal with the inconvenience of switching to alternatives. I’m trying my best to convert them, though.
If GIMP and Inkscape looked and felt closer to Photoshop and Illustrator, that would help greatly. Also, if I could find a good alternative to InDesign that wasn’t tied to a cloud service or a subscription license.
Funny, I could never afford photoshop so I find GIMP much easier to get around in 😆. There used to be a GIMP plugin that changed everything to be like Photoshop, not sure if it still exists. But GIMP doesn’t have feature parity with Photoshop, one of these days we’ll be able to draw shapes.
Is InDesign not already a subscription service?
There used to be a GIMP plugin that changed everything to be like Photoshop, not sure if it still exists.
PhotoGIMP, and yeah it’s still around.
Personally I tend to just use Krita for most photo-shoppy things since I find the interface nicer to use, but I have to admit gimp has been making some solid improvements lately.
InDesign is on subscription licenses like the rest of Adobe’s products, unfortunately.
My wife does book layouts and miscellaneous graphic design work, and she’s been using Adobe tools for so long it’s like muscle memory. Using anything else that’s slightly different is akin to someone rearrange your kitchen while you are away. The tools you need are still there, but now you have to go hunting for every little thing.
Have you tried Krita as a photoshop replacement?
nobody should be using adobe, not even on windows. made thebswitch tonaffinity and never looked back
Adobe products can run on wine now. As of a few weeks ago. I still need to test it more in depth, but they started at least!
What about Photopea? https://www.photopea.com/
Allready did
I would want Ableton to work well and without complicated funky bridging virtual bullshit. Yeah yeah I know about bitwig. I want Ableton
What I would give to be able to comfortably give up MacOS. I don’t even hate it, but Ableton is about the only software that I need it for.
Ableton, recordbox, and traktor are really the only things keeping me from moving full time.
This. 100% smooth flawless reliable audio and midi support from Ableton and plugin makers.
I didn’t want to go back to Windows so bad, I actually taught myself Reaper lol. It’s by far the best DAW I’ve used (former FL and Abelton user,).
Not gonna like, though, it was a pretty rough ride and steep initial learning curve like all creative programs be. I could like it to playing the guitar for ten years and suddenly you have to play left-handed. Like, you can so do it, but fuuuuuuuu
Yeah I’ve used Reaper too and I prefer it for certain types of work, especially orchestral composition, because of the more powerful midi editing. But for digital sound design Ableton seems much more powerful still - do you agree, or maybe I need to look into reaper’s effects more?
I theory you can do the same stuff, just a different workflow. Stock reaper fX are…ok. But vsts perform the same. But…not so much on Linux. Some do, but others like native instruments don’t nativly. And that’s what’s holding me back from Linux. Too deep into eco systems that aren’t supported. NI, addict it’d ive keys, addictive drums, izotope. If I moved to linux it’d change my sound.
Yeah, I do a lot of midi and mic stuff these days as it’s ended up being faster in production to play than to UI tweak. I’ve found Reaper’s “on the fly” for recording so much better (once learned and the brain clicks) and it’s phenomenal score mapping/creation out of the box 😙👌
Just little things like being able to build macros for single key presses with a wireless keyboard behind the e-drums orplugged up guitar, it’s so streamlined and fast.
But as far as effects go, if they’re not coming from my hardware, I can load in whatever plugins I need. I’ve heard some older systems can struggle with VSTs in Linux, but never had an issue. Plus it only takes a single line and a minute to load in a low latency kernal, specifically for real-time processing of live controllers. No more fucking around with ASIO4ALL setups lol
But, yes, Abelton out of the box, much like FL, comes with better native stuff. However, I rarely use native these days as some brilliant nerd or production company out there has made better stuff I can just load in. The emphasis on the W in DAW is very proniunced with Reaper.
Professional, industry-standard applications running natively on any major distro.
I use Adobe and Ableton products every day. I simply cannot use Linux as my main OS until these products can run in a real Linux environment, no matter how much I want to.
Argue all you want about Linux alternatives being just as good. The point is, they’re simply not what what the majority of professionals use.
I would need games to be supported, as well as engineering programs I need like solidworks, ansys, etc
Most games are, but there’s a few asterisks mostly not because Linux is incapable of running it but because there’s super invasive anti-cheat that doesn’t allow it.
I need fans to be supported
SteamOS and steam consoles will be really helpful for this I think
I assume you mean games? If so, yeah I’d love to get into steamos stuff if that’s an option for my pc but it’d have to be like a real os not just geared for gaming. Do you have any info on that
Edit: but tbh I probably can’t because like I said I need my work programs
Steam is amazing on any Intel version of Linux. 95% of games work. It’s not true that you have to use Bazzite or SteamOS to play games, I ran a bunch of No Man’s Sky on Manjaro Linux.
I have a steam deck, which is in console mode most of the time, but seems fully capable of acting as a desktop. The only issue is the fact that it’s console shaped, but that’s no fault of the os.
every distro can run games now
I already use Linux, on and off, but the lack of support for a (proper) CAD program is the biggest issue for me.
I’ve been happy with FreeCAD for my CAD needs, but the stuff I do is pretty simple.
Most games have worked for years now
What games aren’t supported that you play?
For me, as someone who’s not into esports-games, I just expect games to work on Linux now, and they nearly always do. The exception has been a couple of old or obscure titles that run fine in a virtual machine. I’m not running any fancy version of Linux, just Mint, and the only thing I do to get them to work, is install them on Steam. Proton is amazing.
If you are into esports-games, though, there’s a risk that they’ll require kernel-level anticheat, and Linux does not do that.
It feels like the problem with Linux gaming nowadays, is that people expect you to own your games on Steam. Yes, Steam’s support is excellent now. But my GOG games not so smoothly. Is it because of my obscure hardware? Is it my misconfiguration? Or is it me mod my games the wrong way? I’m still trying to figure out a way to mod my GOG Skyrim through MO2.
Anticheat support for this MFer
I tried to migrate to “The finals” but … not the same
