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Even into adulthood, they love bullshit like horoscopes and blood types (the latter more prominent in Japan).
But blood types are real.
Obviously. But in Japan, people think certain blood types have specific personality traits and it gets really annoying when people believe it as if it were solid science.
Whoa, what?
…nope. Considered hormonal influence on blood cells for a moment but unlikely and even then not over statistic noise.
It’s apparently because we have a pretty even split between A, B, AB, and I types unlike many other countries where the population tends to lean heavily on one type, which makes it easier to categorize people and traits.
Tbh, this “reason” is something I saw ages ago on TV, so I’m not even sure if it’s true. Please take it with a gigantic grain of salt!
Some isolated island effect?
Just let people enjoy things, jeez
I mean, I didn’t say they couldn’t. It’s just bullshit.
That’s such a Capricorn thing to say
Um, I don’t believe in astrology; I’m a Sagittarius.
So strange how people will throw snark at others for enjoying harmless fun.
Harmless fun until they talk shit about one of their friends’ boyfriend because his sign doesn’t match and they think he’ll cheat on her… To fish one example out of the sea…
That goes deeper than simple horoscopes. If it wasn’t horoscopes, it’d be religion. If not religion, race. If not race, diet. If not diet, hobbies. It’s like talking shit about someone because they don’t use your favorite distro. Is Linux the problem? Or is it someone’s capacity to pass condescending judgements over silly things? Some people are insufferable. That’s a people issue.
Believing stupid shit like astrology actually affects our personalities and actions is not harmless at all.
You’d be surprised which things affect our personalities and actions. I’d bet my left hat that you have some silly influences over you that you think are mundane and normal. And I bet those things make you more fun to be around too. Or less fun, depending on your company.
Unfortunately false if I remember my mythology correctly. Aren’t witches granted their power as a result of their deal with Satan?
Another comment above addressed this: the “power via pact with Satan” is how Christians present witches, but not really how witches conceive of themselves
Or, maybe because it’s just cool. Might be a super controversial thing to say, but it’s pretty much proven that boys and girls tend to gravitate towards certain elements.
So boys go through a phase where they are crazy about dinosaurs. Girls it’s witchcraft.
This isn’t a universal constant, however, as neither of my sisters have been into witchcraft, and I know one woman who’s really into dinosaurs.
I’d understand if I get skewered for this but people who don’t leave the witchcraft stuff behind when they grow up are on par with disney adults and hardcore weebs. I used to think I could gather chi to perform powerful attacks but if I still thought that, people would rightfully make fun of me.
This opinion is gender neutral but I’m always afraid to express it because it might come across as misogyny.
I think there’s a difference between “these rituals and metaphors help me deal with the struggles of the world” and “yo I totally hexed him that’s why he got the flu”.
The former is pretty harmless. Some people meditate. Some people lift weights. Some people draw cards from a deck and reflect on how they feel about getting The Tower when they asked about their boyfriend. It’s just a lens to focus your thoughts.
There is a difference for sure but meditation and exercise are not really comparable since there’s proven benefits, a closer comparison would be…religion. Consulting the deck is even sillier than praying because you get an “answer” every time which probably just reinforces your preexisting belief
I’m not sure you understand witchcraft from the perspective of those that practice it. It sounds more to me like you’re talking about a caricature of witchcraft and pagan practices, rather than what most witches actually believe
I mean that’s the whole idea, you don’t create knowledge out of nothing. But it’s more than just preexisting belief, you try to grab it from collective unconscious.
Plus, card on itself doesn’t tell you anything SPECIFIC. The whole point of cards and magic is to believe that this specific card has bigger meaning, thus you need to interpret it, and think about it’s meaning. And thinking is useful. What conclusion you come up with depends more on the situation than the card itself.
Just something to think about: the next time you have a difficult task in front of you, ‘gather your chi’. Do the breathing, feel your chakras spinning up, visualize that white light flowing through your body. Direct your ‘chi’ towards the task, then open your eyes and go. See how you feel about what you did by the task’s end. Even better if the same task comes up and you don’t do this so you can compare notes.
This is kind of the level this stuff works on for sane esoteric practitoners. Are you actually conjuring up something mythical? No, not really - you’re psyching yourself up and/or shifting your focus using a psychological tool/metaphor. I personally find it hard to judge that too harshly - save that for folks doing the same thing for health problems without also doing evidence-based treatments.
That said, you’re entitled to your opinion. Just be kind to folks you think are dorks if they aren’t otherwise causing harm.
people who don’t leave the witchcraft stuff behind when they grow up are on par with disney adults and hardcore weebs
People with harmless hobbies? I see no problem with this. Why would a self-respecting adult care if others cringe at their interests?
This was such an online reply.
I’m saying it’s weird that wirchcraft is “culturally acceptable” while the other extremely similar “hobbies” draw widespread derision.
I’m saying it’s weird that wirchcraft is “culturally acceptable” while the other extremely similar “hobbies” draw widespread derision
I think you said more than that. You said people would “rightfully” make fun of you, suggesting the derision is warranted.
But I don’t expect them to care. It’s not like I’m making fun of them to their faces, I’m just thinking “wow what a dork” when I see an adult obsessed with Disney movies
Pick your poison, witchcraft, zen, Christianity… Being able to see things the way a child sees them is an essential part and something you might want to work on.
I’m going to take a guess and direct you (and most readers) towards a Christian reading, but I assure you, this observation is made by almost all traditions, secular or otherwise, across almost all the world’s cultures.
Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. - Matthew 18:3
(Edited for block quote)
I’m not sure coming into a witchy community and shitting on witchcraft is going to get you a ton of agreement
I love to collect herbs. But I hate to tell people about that because just after then, I ccan discover how much people love to believe in “cancer curing herbal medicine”.
My father once suggested a toxic plant is great for health.
It sucks when a hobby you like is full of weirdos. I’ve been looking into both solar panels and getting rid of a lot of my lawn but SEVERAL times I’ve been watching a video and the host drops something about homeschooling or religion. I just wanted tips on growing potatoes, man.
There’s also something to be said about gaining power from the moon because it aligns with our bodies’ natural rhythms as well.
The undead are safer to be around than a man.
Belief in witchy shit is as dumb as believing in conspiracy theories and I place these people in the same category.
I’ll say it: adult witches are hot
Too bad there aren’t any since witches aren’t real
Theory - mass media creates the narrative that witches in the US are Devil worshippers, often with a pretty manly depiction of the Devil, thereby trying to enforce that they “derive their power from their relationship to a man”.
Yes, but that is hardly new. The church already did that in the middle ages and afterwards during the witch hunts.
Isn’t it assumed that witches get their power from the devil?
I think that’s a generally Christian-centric view (which describes anything non-Jesus as the devil). As far as Pagan witches are concerned they could get their power from any number of gods/goddesses, or even from nature herself.
"I don’t hold with paddlin’ with the occult,” said Granny firmly. “Once you start paddlin’ with the occult you start believing in spirits, and when you start believing in spirits you start believing in gods. And then you’re in trouble.”
“But all them things exist,” said Nanny Ogg.
“That’s no call to go around believing in them. It only encourages ‘em."
Terry Pratchett knew how it works lol
When Ezekiel raises the dead, it’s a blessing from god. But when I do it…
I remember this happening when I was a teen, and there are still many women I know into it.
My mother was a self proclaimed witch since the 80’s/90’s, and told me as a child fairies were real, and constantly told me I “had psychic powers.” She read my cards and all that. It fucked me up wholly, and pushed me to science and fact. It’s not for me, and I don’t understand the fascination. But, if it makes other women happy, it’s really harmless.
it’s really harmless.
No its not. Belief in bullshit has negative consequences for the individual, their friends and family, and society as a whole.
Now, is it comparatively less harmful than some other things they could believe in? Absolutely but its still bad.
I was tryin to have good grace here
This is an ironically anti-intellectual way to engage with it. Magic isnt real, but knowledge on the natural world and medicine has been maintained through cultural practices like “witchcraft” in the past. Even beyond that, there’s knowledge gained for young women in a patriarchal society when they develop relationships with other women and identify with a group that is explicitly counter-cultural on the basis of women empowerment.
Knowledge isn’t just facts, it’s skills and introspection. Belief in something “bullshit” is often necessary to learn something that is not “bullshit.” We teach kids scientifically inaccurate information when they are young because they dont have a basis of knowledge that would enable more nuanced and accurate understandings. They “believe” in something like three states of matter and two genders/sexes because we judge that as a necessary belief to foster the skills that will enable them to learn the reality of these things later.
If they gained self - understanding and empowerment through this phase, then it isn’t bullshit. You should challenge this doomerism.
Belief in something “bullshit” is often necessary to learn something that is not “bullshit.”
I fundamentally disagree.
I actually don’t think we should teach bullshit and call it “foundational”. I don’t think that’s helpful at all. If you are teaching kids states of matter, they can count higher than three, and understand that the class wont cover every kind of matter.
If one’s “foundational” education ends up directly contradicting advanced education, it ends up being a way to cement simplified and conservative views of the world. A la “there are two genders” shit that you mention from conservatives and TERFs. If your education system is fostering that kind of mentality its a reflection of that education system’s failure.
Even beyond that, there’s knowledge gained for young women in a patriarchal society when they develop relationships with other women and identify with a group that is explicitly counter-cultural on the basis of women empowerment.
I’d rather women get together based on a shared love of science and engineering.
If they’d rather dress up and act as witches they should get into theater or become goths. Or just celebrate Halloween year round.
If they gained self - understanding and empowerment through this phase, then it isn’t bullshit.
But they didn’t. They obtained a new form of constructed collective delusion & superstition. They’re forming just another arbitrary aesthetics-based in-group to sneer at out-groups from.
You should challenge this doomerism.
Did you read my profile or something?
I’m going you ask you how you would explain fermionic condensates to a child who does not even know what the states of matter are let alone subatomic particles and quantum states; what quantum means even. (Do you know what it is?) I think it’s obvious to all of us why we simplify things for them even if it’s inaccurate for professionals.
Also, you entirely ignored any reality around the preservation of natural knowledge through these cultural practices, which I mentioned to encourage you to also consider how wildly racist this stance is. Countless cultures accurately record their histories and knowledge through practices that dont necessarily conform to the Euro-settler-colonial imagination of knowledge or evidence.
Education systems in liberal states don’t prime children to subscribe to distortions because they simplify things, they do that through obscuring the skills to develop that knowledge and through the systemic enforcement of industrious teaching pedagogies that objectifies the students as labour. Yes, that fails to educate students adequately to grow into intellectual adults, but that isn’t the purpose of those systems. To conflate necessary elements of growth and education with politically motivated education systems is once again ironically anti-intellectual.
Most of your comment is obviously unreasonable, and I think it’s safe to give you the grace to assume that you understand this as well. No, women who get into a witch phase aren’t guaranteed to be anti-intellectual or believe in magic as they get older and there is absolutely no evidence to suggest that it does besides your vibes. I called you a doomer because this is a doomer narrative where alternative ways of knowing are not only discarded, but actively constructed as pathological. I’ve used “ironically” more in these few comments than I have anywhere else in the past year; but this way of thinking is ironically superstitious.
Understand that I’m arguing in good faith, but I am both annoyed and intrigued in equal measure by you. I used to debate in a dedicated invite-only political forum and there was an anarcho primitivist that was frustratingly low activity (though perhaps for understandable reasons…), I place you in a similar category. Maybe you can bring about some understanding in me of your thinking, but I doubt it.
I’m going you ask you how you would explain fermionic condensates to a child who does not even know what the states of matter are let alone subatomic particles and quantum states; what quantum means even. (Do you know what it is?) I think it’s obvious to all of us why we simplify things for them even if it’s inaccurate for professionals.
Irritating reading comprehension. I specifically stated that you can teach kids there are many states of matter but that you are only going to be learning about some of them.
Also, you entirely ignored any reality around the preservation of natural knowledge through these cultural practices, which I mentioned to encourage you to also consider how wildly racist this stance is.
Cultural preservation can be done in many ways. That said, if cultural preservation encourages the belief in woo, its harmful, full stop. I apply this logic to all cultural preservation, including my own or my ancestors. This stance is not a nationalist, or tribal, or ethnocentric. What stance exactly is racist here and how?
Understand that I do want to preserve cultural information, but in an archivist’s way.
Countless cultures accurately record their histories and knowledge through practices that dont necessarily conform to the Euro-settler-colonial imagination of knowledge or evidence.
What is your point here?
Education systems in liberal states don’t prime children to subscribe to distortions because they simplify things, they do that through obscuring the skills to develop that knowledge and through the systemic enforcement of industrious teaching pedagogies that objectifies the students as labour.
They wouldn’t even teach culture or history at all if that were true. Our education also has a history of teaching nationalist myths and lies. And some of the teaching is just lacking due to poor prioritization of funds to pay teachers and provide resources from short term thinking. I work in a community center with an after school program and we are next door to a charter school. The charter school is egregiously terrible at teaching their kids absolutely anything and its boast about its “alternative” teaching styles. Alternatives are not always superior, even if the main methods are lacking or failing.
Do capitalists want education to be completely stripped down to “Teach them to be good little workers”? Absolutely, but they’ve not done that yet… though they’re certainly working on it. Though TBH, if the charter school next door is any indication they wont even be taught how to be a good laborer.
Yes, that fails to educate students adequately to grow into intellectual adults, but that isn’t the purpose of those systems. To conflate necessary elements of growth and education with politically motivated education systems is once again ironically anti-intellectual.
Teaching incorrect things to later correct is not necessary. How am I wrong here?
Most of your comment is obviously unreasonable, and I think it’s safe to give you the grace to assume that you understand this as well. No, women who get into a witch phase aren’t guaranteed to be anti-intellectual or believe in magic as they get older and there is absolutely no evidence to suggest that it does besides your vibes.
My comment is impatient perhaps. I’ve already argued in-person about this sort of thing multiple times through out my life and even if I remain civil usually the other side starts getting unpleasant and defensive and my patience for this shit is very low at this point. So you’ll have to excuse me if I seem rude now but its born of learned experiences.
If some even minority percentage of people who get into astrology start believing the stars actually dictate personalities for instance than I have no patience for that either. Witchcraft stuff for me is just another example of that, only perhaps more “advanced”.
That said, I’m not some authoritarian. If someone wants to waste their time on that gibberish that’s their prerogative. I also however will look down on them, avoid them, and generally not trust them. I don’t owe woo-believers the time of day. You don’t owe me any either.
I called you a doomer because this is a doomer narrative where alternative ways of knowing are not only discarded, but actively constructed as pathological. I’ve used “ironically” more in these few comments than I have anywhere else in the past year; but this way of thinking is ironically superstitious.
“Alternative ways of knowing” Are you anti-empiricist?
Okay, that’s fine you’ve been in “debates” in internet forums, I’m actually an academic who writes about cultural and social norms, and knowledge production professionally.
I’m not going to engage with anything here because its obvious you aren’t a serious person but very much want to be recognised as one without the work. Nothing here is honest and you’ve chosen to argue that I’m just stupid; both good signs that you are very dedicated to your anti-intellectualism.
This has not been a “debate,” this was me explaining a useful skill to you. Some honest advice: stop feeling satisfied with yourself just because you feel smart on the internet. You’re an adult and nobody is going to force you to grow into something better.
You’re a coward.
Thank. You.
because being in a coven with amazing women is preferable than being near high school boys.
