Eneloops would only last about 3 weeks. And disposable last 2 months. This door is used a lot and since it has Zwave and a door open sensor it sends info on every open.
Bonus, since it can handle the lipo AA batteries that put out 1.8v and it gives the motor more oomph I made the battery pack give 7.2v and it never sticks anymore.
This is a garage-door so its not critical access but is used a lot.
rechargeable AA suck.
No they don’t
They do … 1.2v output is low compared to the 1.5v alkaline … they lose charge as they sit there doing nothing unless Enerloop which is expensive and still 1.2v - I recently converted the wife’s led candles (2 x AA) each to 2 18650 each and now I don’t have to charge the things for 15 or so weeks. This guy knows.
The internal resistance is much lower than that of an alkaline, so for some applications, a 1.2V NiMH will match or beat a 1.5V alkaline, but if you really need the extra 0.3V, then they’re really pants.
I bought rechargeable AA lithium batteries. They have a usbc slot on the positive end. Really handy. They do 1.5V.
Ah, portable fire hazard. Love it! :)
That’s only relevant for NiMH batts. If you use Lithium rechargeables, their curve is flat around 1.4V until they’re close to dead.
Low self discharge is the standard now, Enerloop is no longer unique.
1.2v
The range is actually 1.4-0.9v with drop only at the end of the discharge cycle. Much better than regular AA that drops voltage proportionally to the discharge level. Also more amps than alkaline and no leakage.
Self discharge is a thing and putting it in clock or led candle is just doing it wrong. Use alkaline for these use cases.
I switched to rechargeable 3 years ago. I’m not trying to shill for a specific brand, but EBL has worked great and they’ve paid for themselves vs the disposable AA and AAA batteries. They last 4-6 weeks in door locks depending on use, the one in direct sun doesn’t last as long. Haven’t bought any alkaline AA/AAA in years.
YMMV.
Hey I haven’t used this model specifically but a PSA to anyone with a motorized lock:
If your battery is dying seemingly too fast (and it’s not an old battery), your deadbolt is probably misaligned. The friction takes a huge toll on the motor and battery life. They should last MONTHS at minimum.
and it’s not just vertical alignment, but horizontal too!
the problem with mine was that the weather stripping was pushing the door inwards, not that the hinges needed adjustment. had to move the latch plate inwards / file clearance into it so the deadbolt would catch where the knob latch let the door sit
Great point. The deadbolt should move with no external Resistance.
Sound is a good indicator. The motor doesn’t just “get bad” over time like that unless it’s struggling so if it’s louder than when you got it, reassess the installation
This is why I haven’t replaced mine. There’s no real “fixing” this door. It needs to be replaced. That being said if you shoulder check it hard enough it will break open. Ah the fun of inheriting a house that sat vacant for 3 years and had no maintenance for longer than that.
I take it the frame is busted? If not you might be able to just adjust the hinges. I was amazed when I learned how many door problems can be fixed by shimming and carefully smacking the hinges
The frame is rotting. Thank fuck we have a roof over it because you can see through it a bit. Well, you could before I temp fixed it with spray foam. Gotta get the roof leak fixed first then that.
Oh the joys of homeownership lol
Pretty sure my foundation is sinking and I’m just not prepared to deal with it. Hopefully it holds for another year
We just discovered a wide ass step crack in ours. Did I mention ive been jobless since April? 🤣😭😭😭 I just accepted a job offer thank god but the on boarding process is loooong
Brutal! There’s so many DIY projects I’m willing to tackle but that is definitely not one of them
imagine having a door/lock that requires power…
Yea, it is nice being able to check if you locked the door from bed. Definition of luxury, but I didn’t buy this one it was a gift.
Ok, you get a pass from my “or just use a damn normal lock” dad’s finger wagging 😂
It’s pretty convenient actually
Yeah, seems like it /s
I dunno what’s wrong with their lock, but I use eneloops on my lock and I swap the batteries probably 2-3 times a year
I’ve had to replace our batteries in our code lock a couple times in 6 months, but I use rechargable batteries so and just swap it out
In most cases when something is convenient you’re giving something up for that convenience.
And that something ironically at times can be convenience.
yes, I have to change the batteries once a year
and in my case because my ex chose the wrong lock and I can’t be bothered to pay to swap it out, I also have to deal with a touchscreen instead of buttons
It’s the best. We have auto locking deadbolts that lock themselves after a period of time. Each family member has their own code to get in and it has a normal key hole if you want.
Sounds amazing. I’ll know if I didn’t lock the door.
Imagine being locked out of your house because you forgot to bring keys with you.
Like, I’m sorry if you disagree with this, but holy shit, having electric locks on your doors where you can get into your house based off a fingerprint or a code is a fucking game changer.
I have two on my doors, one on the front, one on the back, and I installed them at a week or two apart, so if one of them starts complaining that the battery is low, the other one’s still good. If one of them goes dead while I’m on vacation, the other one’s good.
Plus they still have key locks that I can use if the batteries are completely dead and they can be powered by a 9 volt battery in case I don’t have the key with me.
They’re freaking awesome and I am glad they exist.
You can’t lock yourself out of the house with a deadbolt, they require the key to lock
You can also leave without a key and then your roommate also leaves and locks the door.
But you can lock the handle and leave without keys.
You can leave the handle unlocked, and just use the deadbolt this way.
You can leave the handle unlocked, and just use the deadbolt this way.
This is how I have locked my house for the last like 100 years without a smart deadbolt.
It’s really easy, don’t lock your doors
Hey, Officer, I’m gonna need you to get a warrant to check this guy’s house for stolen goods.
It took me way too long to figure out what you were saying.
Yeah and it makes it pathetically easy to break into your house. Just search online for some of these “security locks using fingerprints”. Its even easier to break into sometimes than a regular shitty lock.
So does me forgetting to lock the door.
I once left my garage doors open all weekend with thousands of dollars of tools in it, along with my motorcycle with the key in it. My garage at the time was quite visible from a very busy street. I got lucky and nothing was stolen. My garage doors are smart now, so that doesn’t happen any more. Sure, someone could hack my home assistant server and open the garage, but that’s way less likely than my continued pattern of forgetfulness.
Based on that logic, my house also has smart locks now that automatically lock when I leave. I will say that they aren’t cheapo who-knows fingerprint locks, they’re made by a real company and just have a keypad with a lengthy entry code. The only added vulnerabilities should be my home assistant server and the entry code.
You know what a security theatre is? Thats a fingerprint lock.
I’m not sure what that has to do with my comment. I don’t have a fingerprint lock.
Unless you’ve got a steel reinforced frame bolted into the foundation backing your steel reinforced door, a strong leg and a sturdy boot will get through practically anything you can buy at a hardware store, and a crowbar will take care of the rest.
Electronic mechanisms are more prone to people being able to be able to access areas without evidence of tampering using simple scripts from the internet, whereas lockpicking is not employed by most burglars. (And as stated previously, level of commitment is greater when destruction is involved, which deters most.)
Having a noisy break-in also means you are more capable of responding if the need arises.
If all you care about is deterrence, just own a shotgun and have a loud dog at home.
To me it’s more like the Kia cars where insurance can easily roll over if a pathetically easy bypass is found. Most people won’t care until houses get cleaned out without evidence of forced entry. Domestic abusers also tend to love persistent access to these things too.
Overall not a fan.
Most analog deadbolts are also pathetically weak and can be bumped or picked quickly with no sign of entry. Networked electric locks just let people have another avenue as well. Some dont, as being electric doesnt mean people network them. The good networked ones tend to use secure zwave (so called zwave s2), which is an improved security protocol that is not as easy to hack as “run some scripts.” The skills needed to breach it are going to be “high effort” compared to a kick.
Some electric locks have gone keyless, so they actually invert this. Generally these locks have a way to plug in a USB C cable to power them if the batteries die, but have no key access. This power port has no data access. Mixed with a secure network protocol or none at all, they are likely more secure than many analog options.
Imagine not having a lockpick kit on you to just let yourself in
Imagine having keys so you can let yourself in when you forget your lockpick kit.
Imagine living somewhere that requires a locked door…
Some of us can’t afford to move somewhere nicer. Recently found out I live in the most deprived town in the entire county, yay!
Yet we have fancy houses worth 7 figures along by the beach… So if despite that we are still the most deprived on average, how do you think the rest of us have it?
In the worst areas of town most households don’t own a car. In the rich part of town almost none of them have less than 2.
Being poor doesn’t equal robberies and physical danger. I live in one the poorest rural areas of my state. We don’t need locks as a rule because we choose not to steal from or assault our neighbors. We understand we are in this together and we need to help each other to make it.
But you would not choose to live here because of the perceived lack of “big city” amenities. Cell service is spotty at best. Even electricity can be optional due to weather. It’s often dangerously cold. Heath care is an hour plus away. (I was just informed I need to switch an antibiotic I was prescribed just yesterday for another. I now get to make another 100 mile round trip to then nearest pharmacy to get it), Even groceries are an hour away. So we grow and forage a lot of our food. Jobs are few and poorly paid and require travel to get to. Our kids often need to leave the area and move 100s or even a 1000+ miles away to find work and higher education.
It ain’t about the money. it’s about the “want to”.
Hard to say. I think England is pretty different in that sense, rural areas are usually more expensive than deprived towns. At least from everything I have seen. I wouldn’t mind a remote area, but they cost more, especially in the county and region I live in.
Scotland and maybe parts of Wales have a few options. But we are talking like a derelict barn with a roof that doesn’t hold out water and no road access, it still costs more than any decent flat here does, but its a little cheaper than most houses.
If its land which you can’t legally live on, same area of land would be like 1/10th the price. They REALLY do not want you to buy some woodland or farmland and stick a caravan or cabin on it to live in.
I’m not trying to start an argument, but I don’t think you understand or appreciate just how remote some places can be in the US. In England you are never more than an hour away from a big city. 50 miles (80.5 kilometers) to the nearestpharmacy, which likely isn’t in a big town, is nothing to sneeze at. Those type of places are cheap and bountiful here.
I was super anti smart locks until I left my garage open and doors unlocked for an entire weekend because I’m forgetful. With smart doors and locks that doesn’t happen and, possibly a controversial take, doors being closed and locked by reputable smart devices is more secure than them standing open. Most crimes are those of opportunity, and a thief is just gonna try the door and break a window when it doesn’t open if they’re willing to go that far.
I came into this thread to scoff at the idea of needing batteries for a lock.
I’m coming round to the idea…
don’t need to, I have it. it’s great. don’t need to carry keys around or fumble with them to open the door, people can get inside without me, it can be set up to auto-lock/unlock on a schedule if you want, and I never have to worry about being locked out of my house
I can head out for a walk without bringing my keys with me. Kids can open the door while I’m grabbing the groceries or other stuff. Can provide a temporary code for someone to check on it while I’m out. Family can have a code for emergencies, or if they need to watch the kids.
It’s hella convenient actually.
I have a similar one and can still use a key…
Why does a dead bolt need batteries? Also if it’s just used form some sort of sensor and the door it used a lot, would that just be noise at that point?
Its the sensor is used for the alarm and to run automations based on if the door is left open. Like turning off the AC and sending me a notification if the door is ajar.
What happens if the door turns into a jar though? Can you really do anything about it?
Usually a keypad entry.
This is great, so far I have only seen hardwired options, never seen someone do a expanded battery mod for their smart lock.
Battery eliminators are the way I hardwired my smart locks. You can find these on amazon in various battery sizes and combinations. Combining this with a Voltmeter Adjustable Boost Modul, doing some wireing, and plugging all this into the wall means no battery changes every 3-4 months.
I am confused, is this not possible to wire properly to a power supply? even though this has increased capacity it would still always be in the back of my head that my door might run out of power 🤔
This did make me realize I’ve never seen a deadbolt reversed. As in the door having just a metal framed hole, and the bolt come out of the frame. Seems like the easiest way you would be able to run power to it. (Maybe not the most structurally sound, probably depends on the door material)
I don’t know. I think that if you built the receptacle right, It could probably work pretty well… Most deadbolts are pretty shit in general (rare to see people reinforce the jamb), so, even an naive attempt probably wouldn’t be that much worse. For a metal door with a chunky insert, I think it would work fine. For any other kind of door, I think you’d probably need at least a frame or large plate to distribute the loads, but it’s still probably wouldn’t be much worse than a conventional configuration. Huh…
I guess the main complexity (or just oddity) would be the keyhole wouldn’t be on the door.
Doors are largely designed to a standard thickness; walls are not. Deadbolts have to attach through the thickness of the material they’re mounted to.
Why did you mount two hydraulic pistons with holes drilled through the door frame to have double deadbolts going into a solid wood door with metal framed slots? Because I was bored and wanted to make hole in the wall and overcomplicate something that can be bypassed by opening the windows I leave open 5 feet away. Lol
Yeah, I guess I’ll add that to the reasons I could never be rich… id do way to many stupid things for my own amusement.
This is how electronic locks work in prisons and jails. Motor in the doorframe with a bolt, power on to unlock, fails secure in the event of a power outage.
In an event of a fire that sounds quite uncomfortable. On the other hand my knowledge about prisons isn’t very profound.
I guess if you had french doors and opened the “wrong” door, it would be similar to a reversed deadbolt.
Most battery powered door locks come with some sort of alternative way to power them from the exterior for emergencies. Or they just have a mechanical bolt.
I could, I actually have a outlet near that I could just run the wire to the battery pack to keep it charged and so the battery would just be a UPS. Actually a good idea and I could have just used 2 18650s for the UPS.
Although this model has a external port to jump start from a USB battery pack.
Jfc is your door on also a tazer?
Neat idea, might be illegal though.
Idk that seems like a genius idea to me.
Does anyone know of rechargeable lithium that can report proportional voltage to emulate what alkaline does? I really want to use rechargeable for everything but not knowing any estimate of when they will die is a huge downside for something like a lock
They do NOT.
One key benefit of these AAs batteries offer full voltage until they die. They’re stepped down to 1.5v from 5v. But any low voltage indicators are based on dropping voltage and don’t work with the tech. They just straight up die.
I just stopped using them in things that are time sensitive like my game controller, but I’m fine with an electronic toothbrush or milk foamer using it since they perform better with full voltage.
I bought Xtar rechargeable AA just for the deadbolt cause I got tired of replacing enveloops every few weeks. They last a long time, but when they drop to 1.1v the deadbolt stops working. So, battery level is always 100% until the day the lock doesn’t work.
If I’m thinking correctly, that’s because the xtars die at 1.1v, but the lock still thinks that’s plenty of juice so it reports 100%?
But normal AA are 1.5v… weird. I guess they aren’t dead dead until .8 or. 9v, but still.
Assuming you’re using 4 batteries, that means the lock is seeing 4.4v and not reporting a low battery, because real alkalines would go down to 3.2v or 3.6v.
So what you can try doing, is adding a small diode in series with the positive lead of the battery. A schottky would get you .3 to .5 ish voltage drop, bringing your 4.4v down to 4.1 or 3.9v, which would probably be enough to trigger the warning?
Or if you went for a regular rectifier diode at .7 to 1v drop, you could bring that to 3.7v or 3.4v, which would put you right in the zone of normal batteries dying.
Diodes are cheap, it’s worth a shot!
Not exactly, my schledge deadbolt has zwave so I can monitor battery percentage in HA. The problem is that the Xtar is a constant voltage rechargeable lithium battery with a constant 1.5V output. They drop to 1.1V to signal low charge. When that happens the deadbolt stops working soon after.
Well done, and I’m surprised at all the technophobes in a 3d printing community.
So long as it has a physical backup and can stay on my network I’m happy. I also need low power draw to stay bellow my 20w idle power budget but that’s a me problem.
If anyone has a vertically mounted stainless steel option with a keypad to recommend I’m all ears!
I’m curious about your power budget. Does that include appliances like water heater, fridge, etc? Or is it just for smart devices?
I’m really impressed by your efficiency. My router alone draws over half your budget. Add the cable modem and a 5GbE switch and that takes me 50% overbudget. And that’s just network infrastructure. With everything else in my apartment I’m probably somewhere around 800w, pessimistically.
That would be all 12v devices that run 24/7. So without the fridge compressor, water desalinator, 120v cooking appliances (when I have a surplus of solar and don’t use propane) and the hot water tank (although during the winter I heat water using a 4w pump and heat exchanger on my wood stove). I guess my work laptop isn’t included in there but I do my computing on a VPS since anything but a low power laptop puts a noticeable drain on my power reserves.
I run off 660w of solar so that’s why I’m so limited. Network runs off a portable open-wrt router plus a LTE hotspot (5G sucks at sea level in my experience) and most smart things are done on my Victron Cerbo GX.
During the summer I generate about 53kW/month and use about 74kW/month. The difference comes from a small generator and the times I run my diesel engine to get around and the 70A alternator charges the batteries.
So my average is ~100w all in.
Sometimes IOT devices don’t make rational sense to install. This is up there with “smart” lightbulbs in terms of creating a vulnerability through convenience.
When I 3d print a plastic phone mount for my bike, that doesn’t make the base bike any easier to steal. This does make your house less secure, even though it adds utility.
Do you now know how incredibly easy it is to pick a lock?
Yes. Being a script kiddie is still much easier.
…. Than you have absolutely zero concept about how easy it is to break into a regular deadbolt. Being a script kiddie or coding is not essier. Using a bump key requires zero skill.
Think of this of more like putting a smart system on a cable bike lock. Do they need to hack it? When you can do it faster and quieter with cable cutters anyways. And that requires zero skill and a cheap $15 tool vs an expensive phone. Vagrants aren’t known for being technical and owning phones or other technology. So with yours it’s only specific people who could do it, vs anyone.
Lockpicking a door is so fucking easy that the biggest vulnerability here is the lock itself probably, you need way more skills to hack the electronic part than to lockpick the lock
Downloading an RFID/NFC spoofer app and loading a script from github?
Only cheap ass locks use unprotected NFC/RFID. Like your debit card also uses NFC. Can you clone a debit card or make a payment with a spoofer app? no you can’t. Just because it’s NFC doesn’t mean you can just spoof it with a Flipper Zero. If the NFC is protected with cryptographic authentication than that is impossible.
RFID is not something you will not hack with a phone app and anyway you need to know what values the RFID/NFC reader on the other side wants and that’s if the the lock has NFC or RFID technologies and not something else
Creating programmable cards is exactly what we did at uni using an android app and a peripheral lol
(Including getting into utility rooms back when the security was an afterthought)
Yes but did you made an NFC or an RFID? As much as i know, most phones have only partial(eg: only reading) or no support to RFID
And again, you’d need to know what the reader on the door want, you cannot just give it any random data and hope it works, i could accept only an encoded password in SHA-256 and you would not be able to do much really, there are probably ways to break thru but at that point is faster and easier to lockpick the door
NFC with solely the phone, RFID using an android app and with a programmer attached via USB.
I mean, there has always been a correlation between being technical (as in profession/skills) and being paranoid about technology. When you are in the field, you get a window into how ignorant most of the tech products are security-wise for example. And I guess a good portion of 3d printing people - especially the ones on lemmy - are technical (as in profession/skills), not/not only tech lovers.
Considering a lock is pickable in a few seconds, what’s the security risk? A lot of these locks even dont have keys, so you’re removing a very easy and common vulnerability.
When you are in the field, you get a window into how ignorant most of the tech products are security-wise for example
Most people just don’t actually think for themselves is the issue. Regular deadbolts aren’t secure themselves already.
Also, if the door is locked, they just break a window or kick a door in. A deadbolt isn’t a good way to secure you house regardless, you need reinforced doors and frames too. So without all these extras, what risk is an electronic deadbolt above a regular one?
Can’t have your keys stolen and your house just walked in either, so that’s MULTIPLE security avenues fixed with an electronic lock.
And very few people are going to be capable of hacking these compared to older and easier methods as well.
At this point I’m quite heavily invested in smart home tech, but smart locks are one of the few things I haven’t touched.
Any exploit found in these devices could be packaged into a smartphone app and easily accessed by anyone. Someone hacking the lock that way would look no different to a legitimate user. Firmware updates for these devices seem sporadic at best.
It’s a security concern I don’t want to have to worry about, even if there are convenience benefits.
You can buy keypad entry deadbolts that don’t connect to external wireless devices. I find they’re a good compromise between convenience and security.
Any exploit found in these devices could be packaged into a smartphone app and easily accessed by anyone.
Anyone can also buy lockpicks, break a window, kick the door down, my electronic lock isn’t even Bluetooth or use a phone app, so that’s not even a possibility with the majority of them.
Hacking it would require technology and skills not everyone has, there’s easier ways to get in your house than to hack it. If that’s your worry, than you better not use your deadbolt at all. It can be picked in seconds.
Unless you’ve got a reinforced door and frame, a deadbolt isn’t stopping anyone from getting in.
Yea its weird. I think its the AI and Data center hate. I am as local as I can be for my stuff and AI free. 99% of my stuff is Home Assistant, ESPhome, and Zigwave.
Rechargeable Eneloops are Ni-Mh which makes the nominal voltage 1.2V where as the voltage on an Alkaline battery is 1.5V. The rechargeable ones are worse than normal Alkaline batteries. You can get rechargeable 1.5V Lithium AA batteries from Nitecore. Those are much better than Ni-Mhs.
Just my 2c but I have 15 year old Eneloops still going. They do have a lower voltage output which isn’t good for certain applications, but they are great for kids toys, remotes, flashlights/headlamps in my experience. Of the probably 60-70 I’ve bought, the only failures I’ve had are with the Pros, don’t waste money on those. I’ll have to check out Nitecore though.
The only issue with the rechargeable lithium batteries is that their voltage curve is extremely sharp, so they hold the 1.5v right up until they die.
Depending on how the electronics and battery match up, your deadbolt might not be able to warn you about a low battery condition, which might mean you get locked out. I currently have two doors, both with a keypad entry, so it’s extremely unlikely they’ll both be dead at the same time. If you only have one keypad entry, then you should probably avoid using lithium rechargeable AA’s.
fyi there are some Lithium rechargeables that have a “low voltage” indicator, where they drop from 1.5v to around 1.1v when low so that it’ll set off any low charge circuit
brand I found is XTAR, but I’m sure there’s others
Rechargeable li-ion batteries are the game changer for me.
All the fancy expensive rechargeable including Eneloop would have a 30+% failure rate every recharge cycle and I wasted so much money. I have 16 li-ion AAs that I rotate including in my door locks and they have gone through multiple recharge cycles with no failures.
I had a similar failure rate then changed my charger and haven’t had a battery fail since. My original charger was Energiser branded, which is the most common battery where I live so I thought it had to be fine. I replaced it with an eneloop BQ-CC55. I don’t love it - it’s a fast charger and it makes batteries uncomfortably hot, but it was able to charge batteries to full health that both my energiser and trickle charger thought were dead dead. That includes energiser batteries!
If your Eneloops are failing that much, they are either being over discharged or something is wrong with your charger.
All of my Eneloops have been much more reliable than lithium ion batteries.
I may be the unluckiest person in the world, but I’ve bought expensive official Eneloops multiple times and used multiple chargers and just gave up. Sure, it may be because I’m doing something wrong, but I certainly couldn’t figure out what that may be.
Where did you buy them though? First thing I thought of was fakes, which are sold pretty much everywhere online.
I know you said official, but did you actually check that?
Amazon Eneloop official store/Panasonic listing, shipped and sold by Amazon (not a third party seller).
Just anecdotal here, but I haven’t had a single eneloop fail me. Heck, I haven’t even had rebadged eneloops fail either.
30+% failure rate every recharge cycle
What is considered a “failure” in this context?
The battery no longer recharges and is effectively trash.
That’s just terrible to hear. My oldest Eneloops are going on a decade with no failures, but I also had fairly good luck when I used to buy cheaper rechargeables. The common thing might be only using slow chargers.
Nobody else has brought this up, but I’ve read that counterfeit Eneloops are a thing.
What about mounting a wireless charging pad to the doorframe to keep it charged? Is that an option?
